Rivered at Full Tilt Poker Again
Check out this hand that made me the bubble boy in a satellite. Instead of a split pot, I was out due to another FTP river. There were five people left, top paid entry into Irish Open Qualifier, next three places paid cash). I have included my thoughts as I played.
Full Tilt Poker Game #1916478405: Irish Open Satellite (14106340), Table 1 - 120/240 Ante 25 - No Limit Hold'em - 0:32:20 ET - 2007/03/04
Seat 2: MARCA (4,520)
Seat 3: 88_RoCkStAr_88 (4,700)
Seat 4: lightning36 (3,265)
Seat 7: hard_bigdog (5,720)
Seat 9: stockdo (4,295)
MARCA antes 25
88_RoCkStAr_88 antes 25
lightning36 antes 25
hard_bigdog antes 25
stockdo antes 25
88_RoCkStAr_88 posts the small blind of 120
lightning36 posts the big blind of 240
The button is in seat #2
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to lightning36 [4c Qs]
hard_bigdog calls 240
stockdo folds
MARCA calls 240
88_RoCkStAr_88 calls 120
lightning36 checks (no raises, so I'll see the flop)
*** FLOP *** [Ad Ks Qc]
88_RoCkStAr_88 checks
lightning36 checks (bottom pair, dangerous board, but no raises yet - let's see what happens)
hard_bigdog checks
MARCA checks
*** TURN *** [Ad Ks Qc] [Qh]
88_RoCkStAr_88 checks
lightning36 checks (I am pretty sure that no one flopped a straight. Let's see if anyone bets)
hard_bigdog bets 480
MARCA folds
88_RoCkStAr_88 folds
lightning36 raises to 2,525 (I am putting hard_bigdog on Q with no Ace and no K, or a bluff. By raising big, I am hoping to win the pot outright by representing a full house or a straight, or at worst, split the pot with Q-Q-Q-A-K)
hard_bigdog raises to 4,570 (obviously not bluffing now)
lightning36 calls 475, and is all in (hard_bigdog must have the queen - split pot coming)
hard_bigdog shows [Qd Jh] (I called this one right -- please no Jack or 10 on the river, but a 4 would be fantastic)
lightning36 shows [4c Qs]
Uncalled bet of 1,570 returned to hard_bigdog
*** RIVER *** [Ad Ks Qc Qh] [Th] (This is Full Tilt - I should have known)
hard_bigdog shows a straight, Ace high
lightning36 shows three of a kind, Queens
hard_bigdog wins the pot (7,085) with a straight, Ace high
lightning36 stands up
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 7,085 Rake 0
Board: [Ad Ks Qc Qh Th]
Seat 2: MARCA (button) folded on the Turn
Seat 3: 88_RoCkStAr_88 (small blind) folded on the Turn
Seat 4: lightning36 (big blind) showed [4c Qs] and lost with three of a kind, Queens
Seat 7: hard_bigdog showed [Qd Jh] and won (7,085) with a straight, Ace high
Seat 9: stockdo folded before the Flop
I was confident of my read, and I was right.
Check out this hand that made me the bubble boy in a satellite. Instead of a split pot, I was out due to another FTP river. There were five people left, top paid entry into Irish Open Qualifier, next three places paid cash). I have included my thoughts as I played.
Full Tilt Poker Game #1916478405: Irish Open Satellite (14106340), Table 1 - 120/240 Ante 25 - No Limit Hold'em - 0:32:20 ET - 2007/03/04
Seat 2: MARCA (4,520)
Seat 3: 88_RoCkStAr_88 (4,700)
Seat 4: lightning36 (3,265)
Seat 7: hard_bigdog (5,720)
Seat 9: stockdo (4,295)
MARCA antes 25
88_RoCkStAr_88 antes 25
lightning36 antes 25
hard_bigdog antes 25
stockdo antes 25
88_RoCkStAr_88 posts the small blind of 120
lightning36 posts the big blind of 240
The button is in seat #2
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to lightning36 [4c Qs]
hard_bigdog calls 240
stockdo folds
MARCA calls 240
88_RoCkStAr_88 calls 120
lightning36 checks (no raises, so I'll see the flop)
*** FLOP *** [Ad Ks Qc]
88_RoCkStAr_88 checks
lightning36 checks (bottom pair, dangerous board, but no raises yet - let's see what happens)
hard_bigdog checks
MARCA checks
*** TURN *** [Ad Ks Qc] [Qh]
88_RoCkStAr_88 checks
lightning36 checks (I am pretty sure that no one flopped a straight. Let's see if anyone bets)
hard_bigdog bets 480
MARCA folds
88_RoCkStAr_88 folds
lightning36 raises to 2,525 (I am putting hard_bigdog on Q with no Ace and no K, or a bluff. By raising big, I am hoping to win the pot outright by representing a full house or a straight, or at worst, split the pot with Q-Q-Q-A-K)
hard_bigdog raises to 4,570 (obviously not bluffing now)
lightning36 calls 475, and is all in (hard_bigdog must have the queen - split pot coming)
hard_bigdog shows [Qd Jh] (I called this one right -- please no Jack or 10 on the river, but a 4 would be fantastic)
lightning36 shows [4c Qs]
Uncalled bet of 1,570 returned to hard_bigdog
*** RIVER *** [Ad Ks Qc Qh] [Th] (This is Full Tilt - I should have known)
hard_bigdog shows a straight, Ace high
lightning36 shows three of a kind, Queens
hard_bigdog wins the pot (7,085) with a straight, Ace high
lightning36 stands up
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 7,085 Rake 0
Board: [Ad Ks Qc Qh Th]
Seat 2: MARCA (button) folded on the Turn
Seat 3: 88_RoCkStAr_88 (small blind) folded on the Turn
Seat 4: lightning36 (big blind) showed [4c Qs] and lost with three of a kind, Queens
Seat 7: hard_bigdog showed [Qd Jh] and won (7,085) with a straight, Ace high
Seat 9: stockdo folded before the Flop
I was confident of my read, and I was right.
Would anyone else have played it another way? Should I have just called after the turn to give myself a way out in case the river was a dangerous card? Other strategies that I missed?
posted by lightning36 at 11:54 PM
5 Comments:
I think you had the read right, and that you played it right. Got your money in and ended up playing for the chop, and your opponent just got lucky. The only other thing you could have done was just call the turn bet, but at that point you are telling him you have a weak queen.
If you were really trying to sell full house, a smooth call on the turn and a raise on the river would have been better. Queens full of kings or aces is unlikely to push the turn. Better to let somebody else catch up a bit.
No raises pre-flop -- you're either playing with someone very tricky or nobody had AA, KK, AK, or AQ. You could probably even eliminate KQ shorthanded like this. All of which means you're probably holding the best hand.
One thing that strikes me in the removed, cold analysis of this hand is that, while your read was correct, you have to figure the best case on the turn is that you're tied with the other guy. Here are the options: 1) he flopped the straight and isn't going to wait for someone else to bet it for him, 2) he has a full house, 3) you're tied with him and you have a poor re-draw, 4) he's bluffing, maybe a semi-bluff.
Given all this, it might have been wiser to simply call the turn and see what the river brought. With four to the straight on the board it would have been a lot easier getting away from this hand.
That said, I doubt that in the heat of the moment I would have played it any different than you did.
If this was me I would not have let the guy off so easy by betting so huge on the turn when your trip Queens came. I would be assuming this guy held either an Ace or a King (or if you're really lucky, AK), and that I could get all his chips by just calling and then getting the rest in on the river. Not sure what the thinking was there with the big raise on the turn, in particular since I don't see how any Queen is realistically going to lay down in that spot (especially with the Ace and the King already on the board too).
All this said, FWIW in this case I would have gotten stacked with 100% likelihood no matter what I did. That river card was despicable and there's no way you're putting him on a Jack after he calls any bet from you on the turn as it is. Just a good old fashioned hardcore boning at the hands of full tilt.
Can't say I'd have played it any different, but what would really piss me off in your seat is when that 10 came on the river that guy probably thought he deserved it becasue his starting hand had yours dominated.
The combination of the sick river and the overwhelming amount of confidence and cockyness I envision my opponent feeling would piss me right off.
Q4 here and Q4 vs xkm. Funny how one knocked you out and one worked the other way.
There are four reasons to play this cautiously:
1) You are on the bubble.
2) You are out of position.
3) You are facing a bunch of limpers.
4) You are up against a bigger stack.
I know it's hard to get away from a hand like this, but you have to take the above points into account. You did make the right read, but he could have easily held KQ which would explain his play with a limp and small bet on the turn.
I think you should have followed your own advice after the flop:
"lightning36 checks (bottom pair, dangerous board, but no raises yet - let's see what happens)".
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